tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-56686018549894398732024-03-20T18:24:31.277-07:00Thrive Learning Institute FraudWelcome!! Thrive Learning Institute was widely regarded as an Internet scam. Lots of complaints. They gave up in 2014. This site chronicled their misadventures. If you're currently in a scam, the links and steps in the sidebar are still effective...Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.comBlogger18125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-45666599035986336842016-03-10T07:57:00.000-08:002016-03-10T08:10:29.987-08:00Why Did Thrive Learning Institute Fail? Lessons to Learn...<table align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" class="tr-caption-container" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto; text-align: center;"><tbody>
<tr><td style="text-align: center;"><a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjXBLE892AloWUzZy4p0IDHALUWQH4AWtCVn2wPRZ_Y1v5tJQ5XCeacBXBp3o9iBytLE8YSsfozkxKozZjtMTCiqKrYKLFFXLZVJe61oaFpkEScIxwyCea7Ko8OXMkws5x4Ss1DgVlXX9p3/s1600/scam-don-hankins.jpg" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto;"><img border="0" height="378" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjXBLE892AloWUzZy4p0IDHALUWQH4AWtCVn2wPRZ_Y1v5tJQ5XCeacBXBp3o9iBytLE8YSsfozkxKozZjtMTCiqKrYKLFFXLZVJe61oaFpkEScIxwyCea7Ko8OXMkws5x4Ss1DgVlXX9p3/s640/scam-don-hankins.jpg" width="640" /></a></td></tr>
<tr><td class="tr-caption" style="text-align: center;"><i>(Thrive Learning Institute Fraud artwork by Don Hankins @Flickr)</i></td></tr>
</tbody></table>
<h2>
Where Did Thrive Learning Go Wrong?</h2>
Well, it started with how they were set up.<br />
<br />
I had a long phone interview some years back with a guy who went by "JoeBlow2000" in the forums. He's long since quit visiting there, but many of his posts are still around.<br />
<br />
And you can take what follows as hearsay.<br />
<br />
Dave Rasmussen used to work for Joe at a big online training company in Utah. That's where Rasmussen learned the ropes.<br />
<br />
In that day, all online training was completely in-house. The only scene outside was some of the independent lead generators. All your sales, fulfillment, and CRM was internal, which meant that quality issues could be handled quickly.<br />
<br />
Dave left Joe's mentoring and apparently tried to take some of the training materials with him.<br />
<br />
He got in with Colton Moody as a partner to bankroll Thrive Learning. But it was always only a fulfillment operation. They just delivered training. If they had complaints about the sales floors, they would have to contact the independents and go over it with them.<br />
<br />
As Thrive only got 10% of what was charged, they relied on the sales floors to be honest (a losing battle) and also to make up their income by upselling their clients with additional services. This is how a $6,000 investment could spiral up to $14K or more.<br />
<br />
Prior to Thrive, the average cost of such training was about $4K. Per Joe, that was carefully worked out according to their experience of what people would pay and stay happy.<br />
<br />
When Rasmussen raised it to $6K, it obviously attracted the independent sales floors, which took about 40% off the top. (The other 50%, per memory, went to the lead generator, who was also supposed to get a percentage of any upgrades, but that was a bit iffy.)<br />
<br />
With that new higher price, Thrive attracted more sales floors and lead generators, then quickly started turning over millions in sales monthly (and at one point, weekly.)<br />
<br />
The stage was set for failure, as customer relations management was inherently faulty.<br />
<br />
<h3>
Where they went wrong - couldn't be helped</h3>
They were working on the presumption that only 3% would finish the course, and only 3% of those would make their money back. (Another 3% of <i>those</i> wound up incredibly successful and wound up on the online infomercials and were used to push people to buy.) That model is actually standard for a lot of scammy industries, like what makes online spam financially possible.<br />
<br />
That means that there's a potential for 97% to be dissatisfied. Theoretically, only about 3-10% would actually complain, and these would be simply paid off and silenced.<br />
<br />
The problems and Thrive's Achille's heel were these:<br />
<ul>
<li>They were teaching people how to use the Internet for research and marketing.</li>
<li>Their own marketing was <span style="font-family: sans-serif;"> to pump up Lead Generation by</span> being at the top of the search engine rankings (with tricks that were possible at the time.)</li>
</ul>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
But complaint forums were found to rapidly take over Thrive Learning's standings, regardless of how many weird backlinks they could create. Thrive's solution was to get the complainers to remove their posts as part of their payment - failing that, to pony up legal harassment.)</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Their complainers found out that they could start blogs and get on the rankings themselves. Not only could they submit a complaint online to Utah state, but they could also recruit other people to do the same. </div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
So a minority few people then started ranking for what they learned to research online and how to post online, using all the training Thrive had given them. This began a small movement of people who banded together to support each other's posts on complaint forums, comment on their blogs, and basically "complain like hell" everywhere they could about Thrive Learning and their principals.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Now, those few complainers looked like the majority opinion about Thrive. </div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
As more and more people complained to the Utah AG office, they became inundated with paperwork - almost all of it was about Thrive.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Eventually, Thrive couldn't keep up with paying everyone off and the excuses to their AG buddies didn't hold water. (It also didn't help that the Utah Governor also had an online complaint inbox, and these complaints were being sent directly there as well.)</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
So, in 2009, Thrive finally got hammered by the Utah Department of Consumer Protection office. All their other attempts at settling didn't work.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
By 2014, they had quit.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Thrive Learning was started in April 2006 and were mostly out of the business by Fall of 2009, and gone by 2014.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
A failed business plan, obviously. </div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<br />
<h3 style="font-family: sans-serif;">
What's the Why of Rasmussen, Moody, et al?</h3>
<div>
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<b>Believing and following Get Rich Quick schemes that used shortcuts and treated people like commodities.</b></blockquote>
</div>
<br />
<h3>
Lessons to learn</h3>
<div>
<ol>
<li><i>There is no such thing as "Get Rich Quick."</i></li>
<li><u>Give real value</u>, far more than you are paid for.</li>
<li>Ask only what the market <i>really</i> wants to pay. Then <u>deliver in excess </u>of that.</li>
<li>Be <u>honest</u>.</li>
<li>Be <u>accountable</u> at all levels.</li>
<li><u>Go the extra mile</u> and avoid quality and customer service shortcuts like the plague.</li>
</ol>
<div>
<br /></div>
</div>
<h3>
Can Thrive Learning Institute be reborn?</h3>
<div>
In short, no. But nothing of the original still exists. Everyone has moved on, and the phone number and training materials were taken over by a different company. </div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Since the name is now open again (the trademark office notes some 75 entries with the word "thrive") <i>it is <u>possible</u> to use this as a learning experience for everyone. </i></div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
While it would be smart to avoid that name at all costs, funny enough, it could be a viable marketing campaign to start a new company that builds on apologizing and starting fresh with lots of giveaways to former students. </div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
You'd have to:</div>
<div>
<ol>
<li>Keep everything in-house. <i>All</i> under one roof.</li>
<li>Start with materials first. Give these away for free or low cost.</li>
<li>Make a name with the quality of materials and open-handed help.</li>
<li>Start free online courses as a sample.</li>
<li>Build a list of qualified, interested potential customers.</li>
<li>Get into coaching only if it looked like this was feasible.</li>
<li>Once a paid program was established, use affiliates for lead generation.</li>
</ol>
</div>
<div>
It is possible, if you start from the beginning with an honest content marketing approach, avoiding all GRQ approaches and people with this mindset.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
If I find out about anyone attempting this, I'll let you know...</div>
Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-74870860696890778472015-09-23T15:01:00.003-07:002015-09-23T15:01:36.100-07:00What Really Happened to Thrive - from the Musty Complaint Forum Archives<div class="separator" style="clear: both; text-align: center;">
<a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjXWymMZ-o7ATY7eVf-KroPJvpEe1nvMjYV4Jp8b-97tY7SRU1Ydb32pH_VekjLllBacAHWV1b_lg-hZheXtWnFS8b1dfoTnFTJbqwf6Rh0mf6rP51bUKPGs4oU37_n2uNbHxEHJFevImTb/s1600/road-sign-scam-pixabay.jpg" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: 1em; margin-right: 1em;"><img alt="What Really Happened to Thrive - from the Archives" border="0" height="282" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjXWymMZ-o7ATY7eVf-KroPJvpEe1nvMjYV4Jp8b-97tY7SRU1Ydb32pH_VekjLllBacAHWV1b_lg-hZheXtWnFS8b1dfoTnFTJbqwf6Rh0mf6rP51bUKPGs4oU37_n2uNbHxEHJFevImTb/s400/road-sign-scam-pixabay.jpg" title="What Really Happened to Thrive - from the Archives" width="400" /></a></div>
<br />
<br />
On Sept 9, 2009 - this was posted on <a href="http://www.work-at-home-forum.com/threads/has-anyone-heard-of-thrive-learning-institute.3061/page-19" target="_blank">work-at-home-forum.com</a>:<br />
<br />
<span style="background-color: #fcfcff; color: #141414; font-family: Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; font-size: 14.6667px; line-height: 20.5333px;">Today on the Utah Better Business website if you search Thrive you find:</span><br />
<br style="background-color: #fcfcff; color: #141414; font-family: Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; font-size: 14.6667px; line-height: 20.5333px; margin-top: 0px;" /><span style="background-color: #fcfcff; color: #141414; font-family: Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; font-size: 14.6667px; line-height: 20.5333px;">On July 2, 2009 the Utah Division of <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_protection" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Consumer protection">Consumer Protection</a> ("Division") issued an Administrative Citation against Thrive Learning LLC, Infusion Media Inc, Concepts Executions LLC, Six Figure Consulting Corp, Vanuity LLC dba Platinum Training Solutions, The Summit Group of Utah LLC dba Momentum Marketing, Internet Auction Solutions Inc and Accelerated Business Solutions Inc ("Respondents"). The citation states that starting during or before July 2008 Thrive Learning LLC ("Thrive"), along with the other Respondents listed, has been offering a Business Opportunity to <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Consumer">consumers</a>. Consumers were solicited and sold materials, education and coaching services for the purposes of enabling the consumers to start their own internet business. The purchase price of the transaction for these consumers exceeded $300 in each case. Consumers were sold online materials and coaching services enabling a consumer to learn about how to sell products over the internet or on eBay. Consumers were provided with access to software that would enable a consumer to build their own customized website to market products and services. Consumers were also provided with ideas and resources on how and where to obtain products to sell, including access to lists of drop shipping companies. Thrive has formally or informally allowed many name and unnamed Respondent marketing companies to sell these products and services with Thrive being responsible for fulfilling the represented products and services to each consumer. Respondent marketing companies were responsible in most cases for all representations made to their respective consumers and were also responsible for collecting payment from each consumer. At all times relevant to these transactions, Respondents were not registered with the Division to offer Business Opportunity sales. These alleged actions are charged as eight (8) counts of violation with a potential maximum fine of $20,000 ($2,500 per count). Respondents also allegedly failed to provide the appropriate disclosure statements prior to transactions. These alleged actions are charged as sixteen (16) counts of violation with a potential maximum fine of $20,000 ($2,500 per count). The Division reserved the right to amend the citation to include unknown consumers who file complaints with their office in the future.</span><br />
<span style="background-color: #fcfcff; color: #141414; font-family: Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; font-size: 14.6667px; line-height: 20.5333px;"><br /></span>
<span style="background-color: #fcfcff; color: #141414; font-family: Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; font-size: 14.6667px; line-height: 20.5333px;">PS.</span><br />
<span style="background-color: #fcfcff; color: #141414; font-family: Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; font-size: 14.6667px; line-height: 20.5333px;">The <a class="zem_slink" href="http://www.bbb.org/" rel="homepage" target="_blank" title="Better Business Bureau">BBB</a> website that I obtained the statment was</span><br style="background-color: #fcfcff; color: #141414; font-family: Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; font-size: 14.6667px; line-height: 20.5333px;" /><a class="externalLink" href="http://www.bbb.org/utah/business-reviews/training-program-companies/thrive-learning-in-orem-ut-22219354" rel="nofollow" style="background-color: #fcfcff; border-radius: 5px; color: #176093; font-family: Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; font-size: 14.6667px; line-height: 20.5333px; margin: 0px -3px; padding: 0px 3px; text-decoration: none;" target="_blank">http://www.bbb.org/utah/business-reviews/training-program-companies/thrive-learning-i n-orem-ut-22219354</a><br />
<br />
- - - -<br />
<br />
I've been looking for this data for years, as I'd read it then, but it was pulled pretty quickly afterwards.<br />
<br />
I'd also seen where this was escalated and seemed to be upwards of a million in fines - but that's gone now, as well. If you're ever in Utah, you'd probably be able to extract it as a public record from the Department of Consumer Protection.<br />
<br />
Note that 2009 date - this is when Thrive actually started shutting down it's social media campaigns as well. The last posts on most of them are in October.<br />
<br />
FWIW.<br />
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<h4 class="zemanta-related-title">
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Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-48719665619780333652015-05-08T13:17:00.000-07:002015-06-16T08:09:05.751-07:00Where did Thrive Learning Go?<table align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" class="tr-caption-container" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto; text-align: center;"><tbody>
<tr><td style="text-align: center;"><a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjCU736qnTN2lw0iL4BQzrkwsif6xDcAJcN9865ZtwBpD-iRL6ghJHqN0odMd4UjZ-Eqd5vrAGIvlYQYXGgcINjTlPt0OlPP0qtX1nltWXUGQDX_YmXYBMLTCJ2C3O28PBCAE3LRwxN2TmD/s1600/thrive-disguise_seth-thomas-rasmussen.jpg" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto;"><img alt="Thrive Learning is Still Around - Just Disguised?" border="0" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjCU736qnTN2lw0iL4BQzrkwsif6xDcAJcN9865ZtwBpD-iRL6ghJHqN0odMd4UjZ-Eqd5vrAGIvlYQYXGgcINjTlPt0OlPP0qtX1nltWXUGQDX_YmXYBMLTCJ2C3O28PBCAE3LRwxN2TmD/s1600/thrive-disguise_seth-thomas-rasmussen.jpg" title="Thrive Learning is Still Around - Just Disguised?" /></a></td></tr>
<tr><td class="tr-caption" style="text-align: center;"><i>(Photo: Seth Thomas Rasmussen)</i></td></tr>
</tbody></table>
<h1 style="text-align: center;">
Thrive Learning is Still Around - Just Disguised?</h1>
Welcome to Guidance Interactive. Same exact address. Same business (apparently) per their <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LinkedIn" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="LinkedIn">LinkedIn</a> page:<br />
<br />
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
At Guidance, you’ll have an experienced instructor who’s already done what you want to do, tailoring your experience and walking you down your chosen path, step by step. The trouble with experience is that by the time you have it, it’s usually too late. But things are different at Guidance. From day one you’ll benefit from your instructor’s years of experience.<br />
Specialties: <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-commerce" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="E-commerce">eCommerce</a>, Financial, Small Business, <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_estate" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Real estate">Real Estate</a></blockquote>
<div>
<br /></div>
Sound familiar?<br />
<br />
Here's Thrive's old header (<a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20131206140322/http://thriveli.com/internet/" target="_blank">courtesy of WayBack Machine on archive.org</a>)<br />
<br />
<div class="separator" style="clear: both; text-align: center;">
<a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEgB7NRtIbQcfyJhxbVjzCg16Zphki4UeGFH_X5MgKOoK8LYtl8p2GJhEesvk_gQNeBnTGM5jUbW3ClEbi1NHZ1rVpxmSMauAOCmg_PxlGrZwdwOjlHR0VQ9qATsoVpZKtET5l9VxYzastUB/s1600/thrive-categories.png" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: 1em; margin-right: 1em;"><img alt="Thrive Learning Institute - scamming at Real Estate, Wealth, Internet business" border="0" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEgB7NRtIbQcfyJhxbVjzCg16Zphki4UeGFH_X5MgKOoK8LYtl8p2GJhEesvk_gQNeBnTGM5jUbW3ClEbi1NHZ1rVpxmSMauAOCmg_PxlGrZwdwOjlHR0VQ9qATsoVpZKtET5l9VxYzastUB/s1600/thrive-categories.png" title="Thrive Learning Institute - scamming at Real Estate, Wealth, Internet business" /></a></div>
<br />
"Real Estate, Wealth, <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Internet">Internet</a>"<br />
<br />
Thrive defined their Internet section as:<br />
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
"<b>Internet Education: </b>Whether a company wants to extend an existing business to the Internet or launch the next big idea, Thrive is there to help each step of the way. Thrive helps you build your website using simple, functional and powerful tools. The Lightwave Builder allows you to build, manage and market a feature-rich, highly professional website. Our professional instructors are experts with internet marketing and online brand development. Our online education and personal training gives our students the attention they need to complete their goals. Our instructors have experience in their respective fields and know what knowledge and tools are required for success. "</blockquote>
<br />
Read <a href="http://www.guidancecorporate.com/programs.html#slide2" target="_blank">Guidance' current page for their ecommerce offerings</a> and decide for yourself.<br />
<br />
<h4>
Go ahead, try to contact Guidance Int.</h4>
Funny enough, there is no contact data on the Guidance Int. pages. None. They don't want you calling them, apparently.<br />
<br />
Now, if you call up Thrive's old toll-free number, you'll get a non-branded recording which doesn't identify the business at all. Pressing "0" gives you "Support" - but again, no company, no person.<br />
<br />
However, first on their list of options has (you guessed it) Real Estate and Internet<br />
<div>
<br /></div>
One of the problems Thrive had was it's long-in-the-tooth Lightwave Builder (that they got from the old Bright Builder as part of the deal for taking over BB's customers)<br />
<br />
On that phone call you'll get a reference to "Ignite Builder". Look that up on <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Google">Google</a> and you'll get an "Ignite Website Builder" on a site called SparkHD Trial. If you go down that page, you'll see at the bottom a list of other programs: Lister Labs, Product Niche Organizer, TeraPeak Research Tool, Drop Shipping Warehouses."<br />
<br />
That list is interesting as this is exactly what Thrive started out with, as it picked up from Bright Builder - Ebay businesses. Make your money by dropshipping, scoping out hot areas and buy wholesale and sell above cost using someone else to ship to your customer for a small fee. (Unfortunately, this area has tiny margins, and requires daily work. In other words - <i>it's just another</i> <i><u>job</u>, not a leveragable business</i>. Believe me, that's the line I got scammed on.)<br />
<br />
We have a lot of data here what walks and talks like ducks - even though they are called something else.<br />
<br />
<h3>
Is the new Guidance Interactive legitimate?</h3>
<a href="https://secure.utah.gov/bes/details.html?entity=8943091-0151" target="_blank">Guidance is properly registered with the state of Utah. </a>You'll also see that their principals are not disclosed, something Thrive did in their later years.<br />
<br />
We do have to note there that <b>there are <u>no</u> complaint reports</b> on file with the <a class="zem_slink" href="http://www.bbb.org/" rel="homepage" target="_blank" title="Better Business Bureau">BBB</a>. Google notes nothing on the various <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confidence_trick" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Confidence trick">scam</a> forums for them. Even the nefarious RipOffReport.com has nothing on them. Clean as a whistle - as far as the Internet concerned.<br />
<br />
<h3>
How about <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=320988856&authType=NAME_SEARCH&authToken=upqY&locale=en_US&srchid=225031211431084861984&srchindex=1&srchtotal=21&trk=vsrp_people_res_name&trkInfo=VSRPsearchId%3A225031211431084861984%2CVSRPtargetId%3A320988856%2CVSRPcmpt%3Aprimary%2CVSRPnm%3Atrue" target="_blank">Zach Bradshaw</a>? Where did he wind up?</h3>
<div>
You may recall Zach from his stint at Thrive - like the BBB still does:</div>
<table align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" class="tr-caption-container" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto; text-align: center;"><tbody>
<tr><td style="text-align: center;"><a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEikQH_yJVls1HdznPQ7fYFo9VnX-CDFYXSnvM8jxRoSszPVy-KqlDVR-hpvtxxm4H1Tu4e8Cnx5HNihgcvjSPFc14WajQTVtTQUUP1Qr-CHJWtPwM8aRv_l5_iZuIqkGzdv6ONAdj2w23iO/s1600/thrivelearning-bbb.png" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto;"><img alt="Zach Bradshaw - Customer Relations and Principal for Thrive Learning Institute" border="0" height="170" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEikQH_yJVls1HdznPQ7fYFo9VnX-CDFYXSnvM8jxRoSszPVy-KqlDVR-hpvtxxm4H1Tu4e8Cnx5HNihgcvjSPFc14WajQTVtTQUUP1Qr-CHJWtPwM8aRv_l5_iZuIqkGzdv6ONAdj2w23iO/s400/thrivelearning-bbb.png" title="Zach Bradshaw - Customer Relations and Principal for Thrive Learning Institute" width="400" /></a></td></tr>
<tr><td class="tr-caption" style="text-align: center;"><i>(Oddly enough, searching Google for entries of BBB for Guidance Interactive brought this up...)</i></td></tr>
</tbody></table>
<div>
<br /></div>
Zach is now the owner of <a href="http://sojocrossfit.com/" target="_blank">SoJo CrossFit</a>. (<a href="https://www.facebook.com/SoJoCrossFit" target="_blank">On Facebook.</a>) Good for him. An honest business with a non-scammy business plan. (Or a nice front.)<br />
<br />
How do we know that this Zach Bradshaw is the one who worked at Thrive Learning Institute?<br />
<br />
Check out his Linked In Profile:<br />
<br />
<div class="separator" style="clear: both; text-align: center;">
<a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEg8Q9P-EQaZM4MCs00LOyHOxqUyzmv-OT2iiLf6p5MAwk2QPdrDEit4cmosHpTrdAlyxyyQuWemqm9EapVBUrJQoE1Io7-JzeDJV6mbeuSXu1DPYFhyGVTs0Ar12DFKvqFn2onbxeIBRMMz/s1600/zachbradshaw-linkedin.png" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: 1em; margin-right: 1em;"><img border="0" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEg8Q9P-EQaZM4MCs00LOyHOxqUyzmv-OT2iiLf6p5MAwk2QPdrDEit4cmosHpTrdAlyxyyQuWemqm9EapVBUrJQoE1Io7-JzeDJV6mbeuSXu1DPYFhyGVTs0Ar12DFKvqFn2onbxeIBRMMz/s1600/zachbradshaw-linkedin.png" /></a></div>
<br />
<br />
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<i>Experience:</i></blockquote>
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<b>Owner - </b>SoJo CrossFit<br />
January 2014 – Present (1 year 5 months)South Jordan, Utah</blockquote>
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<b>Customer Relations Director - </b>Guidance Intl.<br />
May 2008 – Present (7 years 1 month)Orem, Utah</blockquote>
<br />
It turns out that Guidance Interactive has only really been in existence since 2014 according to the State of Utah, the same year Thrive Learning Institute pulled it's own LLC Registration. Both companies share the same address. Zach's Guidance timeline matches when he was at Thrive Learning.<br />
<br />
That's our Zach - the same one you've spent so much time on the phone with. (But apparently, he's too embarrassed to use "Thrive Learning Institute" on his resume.)<br />
<br />
<h3>
How about <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=17940864&authType=name&authToken=tyRe&trk=prof-connections-name" target="_blank">Colton (Colt) Moody</a>?</h3>
<div class="separator" style="clear: both; text-align: center;">
<a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhSsPq2dMuy3FPjzC4r0xq1qtOAdpJt13A8nLKDtu-AG_eHtrinQXhsSmU5DjHvwTW6qMEKY4MzAVEGrCcRnGIpY9xxPjulp3ex8Jw7xFrwVdnWrMVt7FM3mem2-M4ajWhKi56dVZSvm0RP/s1600/coltmoody-linkedin.png" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: 1em; margin-right: 1em;"><img alt="Colt Moody Linkedin - former principal of Thrive Learning Institute" border="0" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhSsPq2dMuy3FPjzC4r0xq1qtOAdpJt13A8nLKDtu-AG_eHtrinQXhsSmU5DjHvwTW6qMEKY4MzAVEGrCcRnGIpY9xxPjulp3ex8Jw7xFrwVdnWrMVt7FM3mem2-M4ajWhKi56dVZSvm0RP/s1600/coltmoody-linkedin.png" title="Colt Moody Linkedin - former principal of Thrive Learning Institute" /></a></div>
<div>
Per his Experience on LinkedIn:</div>
<div>
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<b>Partner - </b>Equinox Nutraceuticals</blockquote>
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
April 2010 – Present (5 years 2 months)American fork<br />
<i>I am currently involved in several businesses as an owner and manager.</i></blockquote>
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<b>CEO - </b>Momentum Marketing<br />
2000 – 2010 (10 years)Draper, Utah<br />
<i>Ceo of Momentum for 10 years, business coaching</i></blockquote>
</div>
<div>
No direct link to Thrive here - but there's long trails on the complaint forums that say otherwise.<br />
<br /></div>
<h3>
How about <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/profile/view?id=137378245&authType=NAME_SEARCH&authToken=3o-7&locale=en_US&srchid=225031211431102480520&srchindex=1&srchtotal=1&trk=vsrp_people_res_name&trkInfo=VSRPsearchId%3A225031211431102480520%2CVSRPtargetId%3A137378245%2CVSRPcmpt%3Aprimary%2CVSRPnm%3Atrue" target="_blank">Dave Rasmussen</a>?</h3>
<div>
This was the guy who started Thrive, apparently getting Colt to bankroll his project.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
On LinkedIn: </div>
<div class="separator" style="clear: both; text-align: center;">
<a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjW48D3TFNeJiLMqCwxaZAVME-MEkNKDEx1IrXuncgpm3X0KxjmfB2kivLWEL0GKEoGhGnqkVp3srOkMUkAbJODluITasZyQmHLUP0aOSQHmAhb8uqsW4d5IZpENmpuYrX4x04mXbMjkHrJ/s1600/daverasmussen-linkedin.png" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: 1em; margin-right: 1em;"><img alt="Dave Rasmussen - Thrive Learning Institute COO" border="0" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjW48D3TFNeJiLMqCwxaZAVME-MEkNKDEx1IrXuncgpm3X0KxjmfB2kivLWEL0GKEoGhGnqkVp3srOkMUkAbJODluITasZyQmHLUP0aOSQHmAhb8uqsW4d5IZpENmpuYrX4x04mXbMjkHrJ/s1600/daverasmussen-linkedin.png" title="Dave Rasmussen - Thrive Learning Institute COO" /></a></div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
How do we know he's the right Dave R.?</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Check out his LinkedIn Experience:</div>
<div>
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<b>Chief Operating Officer - </b><i><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/company/3685201?trk=prof-exp-company-name" target="_blank">Vision Solar</a> </i>July 2013 – Present (1 year 11 months) Orem, UT<br />
Vision Solar specializes in making clean and renewable power available to all types of homeowners. We offer affordable solar solutions that allow our customers to enjoy the benefits of solar with little or no up-front costs. Vision Solar is a full service solar provider including the design of the system, all required permitting, installation and inspection, and system maintenance, all for a fraction of the cost of traditional power.<br />
We, along with our customers, take great pride in going green and lessening the impact on the environment. Improving the world one home at a time is a challenge that we passionately accept. For more information visit visionsolar.com.</blockquote>
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<b>Member Board of Directors - </b><i><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/company/781545?trk=prof-exp-company-name" target="_blank">Enspark</a> </i>July 2012 – January 2014 (1 year 7 months) Provo, Utah Area<br />
Enspark is a leading e-learning solution provider specializing in on demand interactive E-learning courses, custom E-learning course development and E-learning environment management. We deliver our courses in a user friendly Learning Management System that is easily re-branded to fit the needs of any organization. Our team is comprised of instructional designers, corporate trainers and multimedia developers. We differentiate ourselves by providing training that is highly interactive to the end user using technology that enhances learner performance.<br />
<i>Specialties</i>On Demand Interactive Elearning Courses, Custom Elearning Courses, Elearning Environment Management.<br />
...</blockquote>
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<b>COO / Managing Partner - </b><i><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/company/217652?trk=prof-exp-company-name" target="_blank">Thrive</a> </i>March 2008 – July 2013 (5 years 5 months) Orem, UT<br />
<i>Managing Partner of Thrive</i><br />
Over the past several years Thrive has mentored thousands of clients to achieve their goals. The education our clients receive allows them to launch businesses, develop multiple streams of income, and ultimately transform their lives. These results are invaluable to our clients and their families.<br />
Thrive doesn't have a "one-size-fits-all" approach that caters to the easiest clients at the expense of others. Quality matters to us and we focus on every single client, their individual goals, and how to get them from where they are to where they want to be. Our flexible Business Consultants personalize our curriculum, tailor assignments, customize the learning experience, and mentor each client as a unique individual. Our system works.</blockquote>
</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
There's the sound of other shoe dropping<b> </b>- <i>he <u>ran</u> Thrive Corporate (into the ground).</i></div>
<div>
<i><br /></i></div>
<h4>
Conclusion - Did they go clean?</h4>
<div>
That's up to you to determine. </div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Obviously, Thrive quit making money about the same time they got busted for millions by the State. You'd have to find and talk to these these guys at their current business to see if they actually did change their stripes. The thin margins Thrive ran on couldn't keep up with the swamping complaints which deluged them - after they trained people how to research on the Internet. (Is that poetic justice or what?)</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
I can buy that Zach runs a cross-fit company. He told me he was mowing lawns (landscaping business) before he jumped in bed with Thrive. </div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Colt Moody says on LinkedIn he's still managing companies. This gives him the shadiest alibi of the three.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Dave Rasmussen is the hardest to buy -<i> could he really walk away from everything and just sell solar panels for a living?</i> He went from Thrive Corporate to Enspark, which is another online training company, and then to solar panels. That's tough to swallow. </div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<h3>
New people you may want to know...</h3>
<table align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" class="tr-caption-container" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto; text-align: center;"><tbody>
<tr><td style="text-align: center;"><a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEj0RsXjInH_Pu0f6_MokzhPo_bYK_5SXEkYbLHcx9hSqZJS6Q7FIcQRK8l39Lmv4wrv3YhkR9kQe15PN4PcspFP3pduA2HHUOaN2V1A-E4D4z2YQrNywLMWIvZL4FzzDQs3YI5pf9GmK92z/s1600/ThriveLearning-GuidenceInteractive-CEO.png" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto;"><img border="0" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEj0RsXjInH_Pu0f6_MokzhPo_bYK_5SXEkYbLHcx9hSqZJS6Q7FIcQRK8l39Lmv4wrv3YhkR9kQe15PN4PcspFP3pduA2HHUOaN2V1A-E4D4z2YQrNywLMWIvZL4FzzDQs3YI5pf9GmK92z/s1600/ThriveLearning-GuidenceInteractive-CEO.png" /></a></td></tr>
<tr><td class="tr-caption" style="text-align: center;"><i>(CEO Guidance Interactive: Ari Monkarsh - LinkedIn)</i></td></tr>
</tbody></table>
<a href="https://www.linkedin.com/pub/ari-monkarsh/1/288/339">https://www.linkedin.com/pub/ari-monkarsh/1/288/339</a><br />
<br />
Not much there. At least you know his back trail.<br />
<br />
Ari was involved in this type of business before. Maybe he's running this straight. Maybe. (Having an internet training business in the (Utah) Scam Capitol U.S.A with the same address - and maybe even phone number - as a scam outfit: that's not the best beginning.)<br />
<br />
<h3>
PS. The Bright Builder Connection</h3>
<div>
Above, I mentioned Thrive got a deal from Bright Builders and inherited their aging site-builder along with their customers. That's first-hand data told to me and verified by their own trainers and consultants.<br />
<br /></div>
<div>
Bright Builders was heavy into the then-popular Ebay home business model, developing their own site builder and buying HammerTap, which extracted data using the Ebay API.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
If you look up Bright Builders' President, <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/gregcoletech" target="_blank">Greg Cole</a>, it turned out that he first worked for "Colton Solutions" for 2 years and started Bright Builders in 1999.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Did Colt (Colton) Moody have an early involvement? We may never know...<br />
<br />
Since Provo and Orem are right next to each other, it's likely there's some networking possible. The sheer number of scammers originating out of this area says something else might be going on. </div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Let's hope they are all on the straight and narrow now.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<h3>
PPS. Disclaimer: All this is verifiable online. </h3>
I've linked everything except what they Zach and others personally told me. My conclusions are based on what I've found online and my own experiences in getting scammed through Thrive. Your conclusions are your own. I sincerely hope all mentioned are living great, honest lives now. Certainly their (and our) time with Thrive Learning Institute was an education all around.<br />
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Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-83149044479707873242014-10-14T17:47:00.000-07:002014-10-14T17:47:40.340-07:00How to Use Email to Avoid Telemarketers on Your Phone<h1>
Telemarketers will (eventually) leave you alone if you never give out your email.</h1>
<table align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" class="tr-caption-container" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto; text-align: center;"><tbody>
<tr><td style="text-align: center;"><a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhBI0GUQL08Aj97i50eTSNY_57N1pRvP9HR3oWrc08-ilDTnuAbetjSjwFS_CaJwAS6pkyzugRnQORgOD2T1yZz07cr1byq5z0mR_eUh_B0fpCwGwPAOS1Eh-6n9Yd19err5o5TBXkq63oD/s1600/telemarketers_bart.jpg" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto;"><img alt="Avoid telemarketers like Thrive Learning and Mike Filsaime used by not giving them your email." border="0" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEhBI0GUQL08Aj97i50eTSNY_57N1pRvP9HR3oWrc08-ilDTnuAbetjSjwFS_CaJwAS6pkyzugRnQORgOD2T1yZz07cr1byq5z0mR_eUh_B0fpCwGwPAOS1Eh-6n9Yd19err5o5TBXkq63oD/s1600/telemarketers_bart.jpg" height="400" title="Avoid telemarketers like Thrive Learning and Mike Filsaime used by not giving them your email." width="400" /></a></td></tr>
<tr><td class="tr-caption" style="text-align: center;"><i>(photo: Bart)</i></td></tr>
</tbody></table>
<div>
<br /></div>
I was digging around looking into whether a similar scene to Thrive Learning was happening in and among the <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Internet">Internet</a> Marketing guru's. And this gave us another lesson which we knew about years ago.<br />
<br />
<a href="http://saltydroid.info/the-internet-marketing-syndicate/" target="_blank">Saltydroid</a> states that there is a band of Internet <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marketing" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Marketing">Marketers</a> who have banded together in something called <a href="http://saltydroid.info/the-internet-marketing-syndicate/" target="_blank">The Syndicate</a> - which they claim is more of a trade union. (The idea is that they organize between themselves to make sure they mail to each other's launches and coordinate. They also share price points and other data.)<br />
<br />
Now saltydroid says on his site that <a class="zem_slink" href="http://www.mikefilsaime.com/" rel="homepage" target="_blank" title="Mike Filsaime">Mike Filsaime</a> is part of this Syndicate and has several articles on him.<br />
<br />
What's more interesting is that saltydroid has a recorded interview with Filsaime - and it's all about his use of boiler-rooms (telemarketers) to sell his products. (<a href="http://saltydroid.info/boiled-gnome/" target="_blank">That interview is here.</a>)<br />
<br />
<i>The trick with telemarketers is that they sell their lists to each other</i>, if they are unethical - which most are. Now the links I gave you earlier actually tell the story of how telemarketers work.<br />
<br />
While the really interesting stuff is in <a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpbENWU2s2MTVBdXc/view" target="_blank">Internet Scam Capitol USA</a>, and the very dry edition is in <a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpRVlIUVBwajFlOTA/view" target="_blank">Scammer Jammer</a>. (As well as in it's younger brother, <a href="http://selfhelpbook.midwestjournalpress.com/2014/02/get-your-self-scam-free-released-to.html" target="_blank">Get Your Self Scam Free</a>.)<br />
<br />
<b>The main point of this is to say that <i>if you don't accept telemarketer calls, and you watch what you are opting-into</i> - then you can avoid a great deal of pain and annoyance on your lines. </b>(Again, see those books above for more details on how to do that.)<br />
<br />
<h3>
<a href="http://saltydroid.info/boiled-gnome/" target="_blank">Mike Filsaime Verifies Telemarketers Suck</a></h3>
In this phone interview, saltydroid gets some great data about how screwed up the various telemarketing scene can get. Filsaime actually tried to make his own, but it was a complete nightmare for him.<br />
<br />
He verifies the pricing that <a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpbENWU2s2MTVBdXc/view" target="_blank">Scam Capitol USA</a> described:<br />
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<ul>
<li>You already know that it’s built roughly on 10%’s - the Fulfillment Centers (Thrive Learning Institute, formerly Bright Builders) gets 10% to coach their clients.</li>
<li>Sales Floors only make about 10% profit off each sale. (out of the 55% they take)</li>
<li>10% go into refunds with the balance going into operating costs.</li>
<li>The <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sales" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Sales">sales</a> person gets about 10-20% or so as commission.</li>
<li><a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Credit_card" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Credit card">Credit Card</a> companies extract their 10% of the take. (From the Sales Floors.)</li>
<li>And the <i>Lead Providers do something with their 35%</i></li>
</ul>
</blockquote>
<br />
<b>That last line is key.</b> If you are providing leads to these sales floors/telemarketers/boiler-rooms, you then get 35% of the take.<br />
<br />
For Filsaime, he was promoting <a class="zem_slink" href="http://prosper.com/" rel="homepage" target="_blank" title="Prosper">Prosper</a>, who started out with $2500 packages for phone coaching. So he was getting $875 for every person who signs up. (The trick is that Filsaime already sold some product to that person, based somewhat on Prosper's training, and then shared the email address with Prosper. Anything he gets from them is just extra cash - he doesn't have to deliver any goods to the customer or do fulfillment at all for anything Prosper sells them. Nice work.)<br />
<br />
<i>Thrive Learning was caught in their mess of being an independent with their fulfillment.</i> That chapter in <a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpbENWU2s2MTVBdXc/view" target="_blank">Scam Capitol</a> laid out exactly why they failed. They had no real control over the independent boiler-rooms/sales floors - but were nailed for not fulfilling the promises. Sales floors would come and go. But Thrive was supposedly there for the long haul. Eventually, it got to be more costly than it was worth. (And in a little over a year, they were busted by the government, and in 5 years, they were completely gone.)<br />
<br />
Note: Prosper is arguably one of the still-standing "decent" places which do telemarketing, because their sales and fulfillment are all in-house This means they can actually be regulated by the government. The indies are simply fined and forced out of business after wrecking lots of people's lives.<br />
<br />
Now here's that <a href="http://saltydroid.info/boiled-gnome/" target="_blank">link</a> again, so you can <a href="http://saltydroid.info/boiled-gnome/" target="_blank">hear Mike Filsaime talk about how weird and crazy the telemarketers are</a>. Go ahead and get the books linked above for yourself for your own education.<br />
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Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-82432935150037670242014-10-14T16:39:00.000-07:002014-10-14T16:39:14.701-07:00How do you like the site update?<table align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" class="tr-caption-container" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto; text-align: center;"><tbody>
<tr><td style="text-align: center;"><a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEg2sONukk2FIZxFOfRN60RJcQ_g4anFIrSP0BaZWXONxzexBbUQDpZQrj9It1N7wYWXEKCch5xD4FlUE7BSj6YUc_UUOHAnT_96bOSXp06MCC7ahkSHNe4E-A0MbrWvHCKUSUMFaAMr-2HV/s1600/new-look_timlewisnm.jpg" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto;"><img border="0" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEg2sONukk2FIZxFOfRN60RJcQ_g4anFIrSP0BaZWXONxzexBbUQDpZQrj9It1N7wYWXEKCch5xD4FlUE7BSj6YUc_UUOHAnT_96bOSXp06MCC7ahkSHNe4E-A0MbrWvHCKUSUMFaAMr-2HV/s1600/new-look_timlewisnm.jpg" height="225" width="400" /></a></td></tr>
<tr><td class="tr-caption" style="text-align: center;"><i>(photo: </i>timlewisnm)</td></tr>
</tbody></table>
<h1>
Gave the blog a new look - hope you like it...</h1>
Just a short post. Thought we needed to improve the old blog with some new styles.<br />
<br />
Everything is still there - just new ways to subscribe, so you don't miss anything.<br />
<br />
So make sure you sign up for emails or put it in your <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RSS" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="RSS">RSS</a> newsreader (if you have one.)<br />
<br />
Otherwise, stay tuned. Just because Thrive Learning quit, doesn't mean we are going to. Lots of lessons to glean from their fiasco and demise.<br />
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Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-65887100886669408272014-10-11T14:26:00.003-07:002014-10-11T17:57:08.725-07:00Utah Scam King - Former AG Mark Shurtleff Arrested<h1>
<a href="http://saltydroid.info/mark-shurtleff-orange-is-the-new-green/" target="_blank">Mark Shurtleff was arrested for accepting </a><a href="http://saltydroid.info/mark-shurtleff-orange-is-the-new-green/" target="_blank">bribes from Utah scammers.</a></h1>
<div class="separator" style="clear: both; text-align: center;">
</div>
<table align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" class="tr-caption-container" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto; text-align: center;"><tbody>
<tr><td style="text-align: center;"><a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjj7IEwcGV9L4XTRgjc9Y56auyUII1zMlMg71514ZN2Sg2UXvfWwKZWqTaZNhJwpHl8Sm3hrZJAdJWgVvPu1aXbayWA6WUuDyuCcUie01ht1rG-4wZDd4Q1O_0eaGIYIVoFlqWKLoU8zSpg/s1600/shurtleff-callcenter.jpg" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto;"><img border="0" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEjj7IEwcGV9L4XTRgjc9Y56auyUII1zMlMg71514ZN2Sg2UXvfWwKZWqTaZNhJwpHl8Sm3hrZJAdJWgVvPu1aXbayWA6WUuDyuCcUie01ht1rG-4wZDd4Q1O_0eaGIYIVoFlqWKLoU8zSpg/s1600/shurtleff-callcenter.jpg" /></a></td></tr>
<tr><td class="tr-caption" style="text-align: center;"><i>(photo originally from <a href="http://www.cityweekly.net/utah/called-into-question/Content?oid=2137457" target="_blank">SLC Weekly</a>)</i></td></tr>
</tbody></table>
<br />
The one guy who took money from Thrive Learning, Summit Group, etc. <i>instead of shutting them down</i> is now to spend 30 years in jail.<br />
<br />
Happened in July - (just catching up - I've been off doing other things.)<br />
<br />
<a href="http://saltydroid.info/mark-shurtleff-orange-is-the-new-green/" target="_blank">SaltyDroid</a> has been following this guy for awhile ('Droid started in 2009, interestingly) and was satisfyingly gloating over this.<br />
<br />
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<a href="http://saltydroid.info/mark-shurtleff-attorney-general-of-mlm/" target="_blank">Mark Shurtleff Attorney General of MLM</a> … detailed a few of the many connections between Mr. Shurtleff and the Utah’s pyramid scheme “industry.” Most {<em>prolly all</em>}
MLMs are <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyramid_scheme" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Pyramid scheme">pyramid schemes</a> … and Utah is the undisputed center of that
world. Mark Shurtleff didn’t just take bribes from these parasites :: he
actively participated in their shenanigans … and continued to do so
until the very end.</blockquote>
And there's some great videos on the blog post to watch.<br />
<br />
Of course, it's at least 5 years too late for most of us. But at least it's something.<br />
<br />
Far more details <a href="http://mlmtheamericandreammadenightmare.blogspot.com/2014/07/major-mlm-crook-mark-shurtleff-arrested.html" target="_blank">here</a>:<br />
<br />
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
<span class="dateline" style="background-color: white; color: #1a2732; font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px; margin: 0px; padding: 0px;"><b><a class="zem_slink" href="http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=40.75,-111.883333333&spn=0.1,0.1&q=40.75,-111.883333333%20(Salt%20Lake%20City)&t=h" rel="geolocation" target="_blank" title="Salt Lake City">SALT LAKE CITY</a> July 15th 2014</b> -- </span><span style="background-color: white; color: #1a2732; font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; line-height: 19px;">After investigating for more than a year, authorities on Tuesday arrested two former Utah attorneys general on charges of bribery, misusing public funds and other counts. <a class="zem_slink" href="http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=40.67,-111.93&spn=1.0,1.0&q=40.67,-111.93%20(Salt%20Lake%20County%2C%20Utah)&t=h" rel="geolocation" target="_blank" title="Salt Lake County, Utah">Salt Lake County</a> <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/District_attorney" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="District attorney">District Attorney</a> Sim Gill on Tuesday laid out allegations against <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Swallow" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="John Swallow">John Swallow</a> and Mark Shurtleff that involve gold coins, luxury houseboats and jets and thousands of dollars in cash or campaign contributions.</span></blockquote>
<br />
Cheers.<br />
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Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-56361677893062154292014-10-11T07:04:00.000-07:002014-10-11T07:04:15.289-07:00Uncovering the Skeletons of the Thrive Learning LLC Scam<h1 style="text-align: center;">
Thrive Learning <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limited_liability_company" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Limited liability company">LLC</a> Died With Scam Skeletons in its Closets.</h1>
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<tr><td class="tr-caption" style="text-align: center;"><i>(photo: <a href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/cookiejan/" target="_blank">Jan</a>)</i></td></tr>
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<br />
<b>By far the largest <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complaint" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Complaint">complaint</a> (second only to the ripoffs) is how Thrive Learning made so many blogs and complaints just disappear from the Web.</b><br />
<br />
Reportedly, it's been when the individuals got their <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money_back_guarantee" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Money back guarantee">refund</a> paid and the check cleared.<br />
<br />
Digging around (and nothing ever really leaves the <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Internet">Internet</a>) I found these collections of an old site called stop-telemarketers.blogspot.com (its back up now, but without the original data.)<br />
<br />
I found a copy of "Scammer Jammer" and "<a class="zem_slink" href="http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=39.5,-111.5&spn=3.0,3.0&q=39.5,-111.5%20(Utah)&t=h" rel="geolocation" target="_blank" title="Utah">Utah</a>: <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_fraud" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Internet fraud">Internet Scam</a> Capitol of the World".<br />
<br />
There's also a cover:<br />
<br />
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<a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEg9dzXj79VwWQB4L843JWEUl694b0_WqQh_byGZLYO63GtTgAVr37eqTiJQd8-0bJS3c5ADvyWoev394v1RkhXA15TCywQkizadkYwtK0F8qagsvDZzeIsRYOpKZ29LAqTwE0sHjMWwNiV5/s1600/3Dcover.png" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: 1em; margin-right: 1em;"><img alt="Scammer Jammer book - exposing Thrive Learning LLC: died with Scam Skeletons in it's closets.b" border="0" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEg9dzXj79VwWQB4L843JWEUl694b0_WqQh_byGZLYO63GtTgAVr37eqTiJQd8-0bJS3c5ADvyWoev394v1RkhXA15TCywQkizadkYwtK0F8qagsvDZzeIsRYOpKZ29LAqTwE0sHjMWwNiV5/s1600/3Dcover.png" height="400" title="Scammer Jammer book - exposing Thrive Learning LLC: died with Scam Skeletons in it's closets." width="311" /></a></div>
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Here's the links:<br />
<br />
<a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpN01DR081T0pfMjA/view?usp=sharing" target="_blank">https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpN01DR081T0pfMjA/view?usp=sharing </a><br />
<a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpRVlIUVBwajFlOTA/view?usp=sharing">https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpRVlIUVBwajFlOTA/view?usp=sharing</a><br />
<a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpUXk0MndpRG9iS0E/view?usp=sharing">https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpUXk0MndpRG9iS0E/view?usp=sharing</a><br />
<a href="https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpbENWU2s2MTVBdXc/view?usp=sharing">https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5AYlZ41aftpbENWU2s2MTVBdXc/view?usp=sharing</a><br />
<br />
What you'll find there is one person using the tools he knew - online researching - to dig up how and why he got scammed, as well as how to get his money back. (Of course, he had some help from all of you out there, particularly the mysterious "JoeBlow2000".)<br />
<br />
<b>One of these is the missing blog posts - his whole timeline up to the point of his refund. </b>Sometime after that, the blog disappeared for awhile - then showed up without the posts. This is very possibly the most complete recovery of that data available. (<a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20090428150534/http://stop-telemarketers.midwestjournalpress.com/page/3" target="_blank">The Wayback Machine has a few scintillating scrapes</a>.)<br />
<br />
<b>You'll also be able to see why Thrive Learning wanted this book banned</b> - <i>and all copies destroyed</i>. It tells exactly why those certain refund steps are very effective. I understand that everyone this author helped directly got their refund - 100%. (Of course, Thrive sued his a** to get him to stop...) There's a possibility I can contact the author to get the paperback available in print again, if you want a copy...<br />
<br />
<i>So now you can read the history of this Thrive Learning mess</i> - how it started, how the people in charge were paying the then Utah AG Shurtleff to look the other way, how a few dedicated people took the necessary steps to get the government to actually do what they were supposed to be doing - in spite of personal danger from Thrive's in-house lawyers.<br />
<br />
There is a chance that what is covered in these <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Book">books</a> can be used to straighten out other Internet scams ongoing. I see that this pattern is still continuing with other companies. Maybe we have more work to do?<br />
<br />
Do what you want with these. Or buy the guy's books.<br />
<br />
It's all over to you. Thrive Learning is history - or at least that chapter of it...<br />
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Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-84320868896914463872014-10-10T15:29:00.000-07:002014-10-10T15:29:41.178-07:00The final lessons - can a man-eating tiger ever change its stripes?<h1>
Can a tiger change its stripes, once scamming is in its blood?</h1>
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<tr><td class="tr-caption" style="text-align: center;"><i>(photo: <a href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/rhruzek/" target="_blank">Robert Hruzek</a>)</i></td></tr>
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Calling a tiger a cat, or a feline, or something else doesn't change the fact that it has stripes and is a predator. In India, once a tiger has gotten the taste of humankind - it has to be tracked down and destroyed before it victimizes someone else. Similar is the sitiuation with scammers.<br />
<br />
Utah's sales floors have routinely simply renamed and reorganized to get out from under government scrutiny (and no longer having to pay refunds.) This is why Utah requires they post a $50,000 bond before starting - which can be paid out to victims as long as it lasts. Now, perhaps, it is the same with Utah fulfillment centers.<br />
<br />
On the <a href="http://www.linkedin.com/company/thrive-corporate-llc" target="_blank">"ThriveCorporate" LinkedIn page</a>, you see this:<br />
<blockquote class="tr_bq">
"<span style="background-color: white; color: #333333; font-family: Helvetica, FreeSans, 'Liberation Sans', Helmet, Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 13px; line-height: 17px;">Thrive was acquired by a <a class="zem_slink" href="http://www.wikinvest.com/concept/Private_Equity" rel="wikinvest" target="_blank" title="Private Equity">private equity</a> firm and is no longer an operating entity."</span></blockquote>
Thrivecorporate.com is up for sale as a domain. (Thriveli.com and thrivelearninginstitute.com are still gateways to private training programs - but have no real web presence and no longer really show up well on Google.)<br />
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Checking the <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/" target="_blank">Wayback Machine</a>, showed thriveli.com <a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20140108155833/http://thriveli.com/" target="_blank">last snapshot as a fully-functioning site was Jan 8, 2014</a>.<br />
<br />
Checking the Utah.gov Business Search shows that in fact, <a href="https://secure.utah.gov/bes/action/details?entity=6958911-0160" target="_blank">Thrive Learning LLC was voluntarily dissolved on 4/24/2014.</a></div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
However, the <a href="http://www.bbb.org/utah/business-reviews/training-programs/thrive-learning-in-orem-ut-22219354/complaints" target="_blank">most recent complaint about their services is found on the BBB, dated 26 August.</a><br />
<br /></div>
<div>
A birdy told me recently about a new company which is at the very same address that Thrive Learning Institute and ThriveCorporate have been using: <a href="https://www.google.com/search?q=512+W+800+N%2C+Orem%2C+Utah+84057" target="_blank">512 W 800 N, Orem, Utah 84057</a></div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
This new company is "<a href="http://www.guidancecorporate.com/" target="_blank">Guidance Interactive</a>. (<a href="https://www.linkedin.com/company/guidance-intl-" target="_blank">On LinkedIn</a>.)</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
The only other thing in common is that they both deal in three main subject areas (Internet/Ecommerce, <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Real_estate" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Real estate">Real Estate</a>, and Wealth/Financial.)</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
Since the Guidance site lacks any sort of contact links (and is also missing disclaimer pages which the <a class="zem_slink" href="http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=39.5,-111.5&spn=3.0,3.0&q=39.5,-111.5%20(Utah)&t=h" rel="geolocation" target="_blank" title="Utah">State of Utah</a> requires, I believe) - there is no bona-fide link between the two companies. In fact, you can look up the address above and see that there have been ads to lease office space at that location.<br />
<br />
There is a <a href="https://secure.utah.gov/bes/action/details?entity=8943091-0151" target="_blank">Guidance Interactive LLC which was registered by a different agent</a> (Midvale instead of Provo.) It became active Feb 11, 2014. So the overlapping dates shows it's possible - but still no smoking gun.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
It may be just an unhappy coincidence.</div>
<div>
<br /></div>
<div>
We'll see...<br />
<br />
- - - -<br />
<br />
<h3>
<b>Unless you are currently receiving services from whoever has taken over Thrive's "business coaching" contracts, the show is over.</b> </h3>
Good luck getting anything from Thrive now - you'll have to take it up with that "private equity firm." You may or may not be able to use the well-known private cel phone numbers of Thrive's former principals<br />
<br />
<i>History:</i> Thrive itself bought out Bright Builder coaching contracts, and got the "Lightwave Builder" software as part of it. As a side note, Lightwave was already long in the tooth and was actually much more easily replaced by the constantly-updated Wordpress as a platform.<br />
<br />
<h3>
How getting a refund from Thrive worked and why</h3>
Thrive Learning started in around April 2008. The BBB has them dated to 2001, but that was a slight-of-hand, since the LLC was owned by a private equity firm (which name escapes me currently, and not really worth looking up) - that was started then. The Wayback Machine's earliest record of thriveli.com was 30 April 08.<br />
<br />
Thrive was perhaps the first to set themselves up as fulfillment-only business. Before this, everything was in-house: sales, fulfillment, customer service. Thrive would contract with various independent sales floors to sell their fulfillment package. Thrive's cut was 10%, and the sales floor got about 60%. (I forget who else got a split right now - this is, again, not worth my time. I'll see if I can now resurrect my copies of old posts and books on this subject, where this was all documented.)<br />
<br />
But they also nearly doubled the asking price for that training that the in-house companies charged. Meanwhile, they didn't have a feedback loop (supposedly) on how the sales floors represented them. (Factually, they didn't care enough. Taking a trip across town to one of the call centers was <i>always</i> an option. You just have to <i>decide</i> to do it. But that means being <i>responsible</i>, doesn't it?)<br />
<br />
So Thrive - on paper - was only responsible for refunding that 10%. Actually, once someone started spilling the goods about Thrive online, they would make sure that person got a refund (in exchange for removing all their content they posted) and get the money back from the sales floors.<br />
<br />
How these refunds were funded, even though they delivered scammy services, was a bit of a <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponzi_scheme" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Ponzi scheme">Ponzi scheme</a>. While the bulk of the sales income went to sales people, there were always new customers coming in. The sales floors could pay back Thrive from new income.<br />
<br />
Since only about 3% of their customers actually refunded, this worked out.<br />
<br />
Until, people started complaining to the State of Utah too much.<br />
<br />
That list of steps they took (as posted on the left) was worked out from trial and error. Essentially, the point was to "complain like hell" until the refund arrived. The main problem Thrive set up for itself was trying to be what it was not - respectable. It's marketing scene was huge on the then-current SEO approach of setting up multiple presences on social networks. This gave them complete "dominance" on Google for most of the front page - a huge amount of testimonials about how great Thrive was. Nice sales tool.<br />
<br />
And that worked until the complaint forums started ranking better than anything they did. Thrive's response was to require people take down complaints and websites they had and quit saying anything about Thrive at all - and then they'd get a refund. (Now that Thrive doesn't exist is why I can actually say this.)<br />
<br />
<b>Note</b>: it was the personal comments about the principals - and linking to the data online - that sped up the process. People were able to use the Internet to find all sorts of fascinating details about people (even home addresses.) The principals didn't like being named, so they pushed to get refunds sent. What these principals didn't know that a year's worth of being connected to Thrive Learning LLC was going to screw their ever being able to enjoy having an Internet presence - they went into seclusion as far as they could, which wasn't enough...<br />
<br />
<h3>
<b>Thrive was trying to plug a leaking dike with more holes than they had fingers available. </b></h3>
<i>Thrive's problem was that they were taking people and making them computer-literate.</i> They trained people how to search for things. They trained people to post things online. They trained people to use social networks.<br />
<br />
So they unleashed a flood of complainers who either didn't ask for a refund, or were easily put off. The complaints never went away.<br />
<br />
And even today, all the data these missing sites had still exist in various formats on those complaint forums. Most people took that long list of complaint forums (again, it's over to the left) and posted the same complaint on all of them.<br />
<br />
Thrive wound up being the top of a very smelly heap online. You had to usually go to page 2 in order to find something complementary.<br />
<br />
Even today, that phrase gets tons of complaint forums and little else - while most of these posts are from 2009.<br />
<br />
Thrive Learning LLC has simply given up the pretense and sold out to someone else (or maybe the same people - we may never know for sure.)<br />
<br />
<h3>
What Thrive didn't understand about the Internet</h3>
<i>The Internet works on the Golden Rule.</i> As you treat others, is how you'll be treated. Not that people didn't try to tell them. You have to deliver goods and services which are far better than people expect - and keep doing this routinely.<br />
<br />
Sure, there are a lot of hyper-critical trolls online. These can mostly be ignored (like Rip-Off Reports, which is it's own shake-down scene.) When you have floods of complaints coming in, with specific facts - then you'd better change your operating basis.<br />
<br />
Thrive didn't.<br />
<br />
As said above, the list says to contact the Utah government - and people kept helping others by giving them the exact link to use, what the government contact's name was, and how to report it. This was very effective. Because that one Utah government department now was tied up with handling the complaints for this one company. And the government got tired of it.<br />
<br />
On July 2, 2009, Utah lowered the boom. <a href="http://www.work-at-home-forum.com/threads/has-anyone-heard-of-thrive-learning-institute.3061/page-19" target="_blank">A copy of this is found on the work-at-home forum</a>. But it's incomplete. The version I recall came to several million dollars in fines. Individuals were named, as well as other "private equity firms."<br />
<br />
That was basically the end of Thrive. They paid their fines. They toed the line. They kept up appearances, more or less. Meaning somehow, the sales floors were bringing in income for them. You'll see that Thrive quit posting video's and articles and so on by the end of that year. And the complaints dwindled off - mostly.<br />
<br />
(So April 2008 to July 2009. Helluva ride, eh?)<br />
<br />
<h3>
<b>Thrive was their own worst enemy.</b> </h3>
They relied on naive people to stay naive. But their business plan was to train the naivety right out of them. They relied on Utah's 3-day right of rescission (buyer's remorse period) instead of keeping a policy of guaranteed results with no-questions-asked refunds. (They did say it was guaranteed - and they would stick with you as long as it took, but the real problem is that you were paying their hosting fees every month and after a year their coaching was strictly e-mail only.)<br />
<br />
Thrive knew by their own statistics that only 3% of the customers would complete the training, that only 3% of those would actually make their money back (1 in 1,000 - about the same amount who would refund.) The guys you saw in the video promotion - they were the 3% of <i>those</i> - or roughly 1 in 10,000 who made the huge sums.<br />
<br />
Saying that <i>anyone</i> could achieve these results was <i>technically</i> true. What they didn't say is that the very few individuals who did make it had also had extensive training and several failed online business opportunities <i>before</i> they ever got to Thrive. But again, it was the sales floor's fault if Thrive's training was "misrepresented."<br />
<br />
You can see how a lot of this played out on <a href="http://www.cityweekly.net/utah/phone-predators/Content?oid=2161659" target="_blank">Salt Lake City Weekly's article: Phone Predators</a>. <a href="http://saltydroid.info/utahs-shit-in-a-box/" target="_blank">The Thrive connection is found over at SaltyDroid</a> - years after their prime. The Internet has a long memory.<br />
<br />
<h3>
What's true about Internet Marketing</h3>
There is a lot of cr*p floating there. Wear waders and watch your step.<br />
<br />
Thrive made their money on those people who bought into the "get rich quick" scene - and sold them a scheme/scam instead of honest training which they would have to invest years of their lives to learn enough to get anything accomplished - much less make millions "over night."<br />
<br />
What Thrive did was to educate the naivete right out of them. Painfully.<br />
<br />
There's a worse scene - called "<a href="http://saltydroid.info/the-internet-marketing-syndicate/" target="_blank">The Syndicate" by the SaltyDroid.</a> It's a group of guys who have agreed to promote each other's "product" launches to their lists, on a schedule so they don't interfere with each other. You may have heard of these names: Andy Jenkins, Frank Kern, John Reese, Jeff Walker, Ryan Diess, and Mike Filsame. All of these are supposed "guru's" of the industry.<br />
<br />
They use the same tactics, and promote the "latest and greatest solutions" to this same group of buyers who apparently just don't learn - and spend their disposable income on these new "solutions" like a crack addict.<br />
<br />
The percentages are the same. 1 in 10,000 will have a major success. The rest keep their day jobs.<br />
<br />
<h3>
You <u>can</u> make a living online.</h3>
I do. But you start with throwing out conventional wisdom, which means 97% of everything you read, hear, or were taught. Test everything (start with what I've just told you.)<br />
<br />
The short-hand version is<br />
<ol>
<li>Get completely out of debt. Buy nothing on credit from there on out.</li>
<li>Start saving 10% of your income and investing another 20% (and that's after you've set aside 20% for taxes.) </li>
<li>Live within your means (which is that remaining 50%.)</li>
</ol>
<div>
Yes, that's severe. But it works - and is exactly what millionaires in America have routinely done. (See Thomas J. Stanley's "The Millionaire Mind" or his "The Millionaire Next Door.") U.S. Millionaires also all read and/or follow the steps laid out in <a href="http://midwestjournalpress.com/napoleon-hill.php" target="_blank">Napoleon Hill's "Think and Grow Rich."</a></div>
<br />
Next: find something you can offer, sell, and deliver online which <i>routinely</i> sells. Not something that has to be intensely sold - something people want, and have always wanted something like it. The person after them will want it, their children will want it, their grandparents always wanted something like it.<br />
<br />
<b>The stuff that sells routinely on line has intrinsic value</b> - and you enhance that value with better service, better price, or better outcome.<br />
<br />
Once your online business makes twice or more what your day job pays, then you can fire your boss (disclaimer: general idea, of course, not specific advice.)<br />
<br />
We are, of course, moving into what you were looking for when you found Thrive Learning LLC.<br />
<br />
Only this time, we are going in with eyes wide open.<br />
<br />
Because we've been there, done that. Another phrase: once burnt, twice shy.<br />
<br />
There's more work to do before I can tell you what I've figured out. But meanwhile, visit the <a href="http://thrivelearninginstitute.onlinemillionaireplan.com/" target="_blank">Thrivelearning System</a> (thought you might find that name interesting) for several series of books in this area.<br />
<br />
Luck to us all.</div>
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Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-78350273820396609882014-09-07T14:26:00.000-07:002014-10-11T07:13:27.086-07:00Thrive Learning Institute Has Given Up!<table align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" class="tr-caption-container" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto; text-align: center;"><tbody>
<tr><td style="text-align: center;"><a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEixhVZNnirCO3o3vbjGNoXv-rgzxIjGNsiBewXnIN1rHHXiK69-SaQc4H9N8VdW1Sf2yBx5SzjUP7ipBuTLyGa5QEqd27M0WsLkimz6VtJIw1oAZbBY-7wYyuEXTOgM5_jfe0fHnzyV-R6A/s1600/surrender_gloson-teh.jpg" imageanchor="1" style="margin-left: auto; margin-right: auto;"><img border="0" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEixhVZNnirCO3o3vbjGNoXv-rgzxIjGNsiBewXnIN1rHHXiK69-SaQc4H9N8VdW1Sf2yBx5SzjUP7ipBuTLyGa5QEqd27M0WsLkimz6VtJIw1oAZbBY-7wYyuEXTOgM5_jfe0fHnzyV-R6A/s1600/surrender_gloson-teh.jpg" height="240" width="320" /></a></td></tr>
<tr><td class="tr-caption" style="text-align: center;"><i>(photo: You Win! I Surrender! by <a href="https://www.flickr.com/photos/gloson/" target="_blank">Gloson Teh</a>)</i></td></tr>
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Just checked in on both thriveli.com and thrivelearninginstitute.com - seems now they just redirect to some sort of coaching access. So these sites don't come up on <a class="zem_slink" href="http://www.google.com/" rel="homepage" target="_blank" title="Google">Google's</a> front page at all now.<br />
<br />
Even their <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facebook_features" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Facebook features">Facebook page</a> is blank. So Google now just serves up complaint boards for them.<br />
<br />
Seems 2010 was their death-knell year. No more videos or anything else after that. The September order from <a class="zem_slink" href="http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=39.5,-111.5&spn=3.0,3.0&q=39.5,-111.5%20(Utah)&t=h" rel="geolocation" target="_blank" title="Utah">Utah</a> State did something -- thanks to all of you who helped.<br />
<br />
Hope to see you all around in better circumstances - like<a href="http://honestonlinetraining.blogspot.com/2013/12/thrive-learning-internet-elibrary-honest-training.html" target="_blank"> finding some honest training companies</a>.<br />
<br />
I've got my eye on a few - hope to get active again and bring them to you...<br />
<br />
[<b>Update</b>: A bit premature. <a class="zem_slink" href="http://www.bbb.org/" rel="homepage" target="_blank" title="Better Business Bureau">BBB</a> has ongoing complaints as of 2013 against Thrive and their satellite offices (<a href="http://www.bbb.org/arkansas/business-reviews/work-at-home-companies/focus-worldwide-in-beaverton-or-90235211">http://www.bbb.org/arkansas/business-reviews/work-at-home-companies/focus-worldwide-in-beaverton-or-90235211</a>) Do your own research.]<br />
<br />
<br />
Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-78205052825021967492010-12-15T08:13:00.000-08:002014-10-14T17:51:00.613-07:00Thrive is STILL Scamming!!<b>I am sorry I have been out of the loop for awhile. </b> It saddens me greatly to see there are STILL people being cheated by Thrive. It goes to show just how ruthless Thrive is!! <br />
<br />
Many <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blog" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Blog">blogs</a> have been taken down because of the agreements with Thrive in order for them to receive their <a class="zem_slink" href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money_back_guarantee" rel="wikipedia" target="_blank" title="Money back guarantee">refund</a>. I hope all of you are blogging about your sad experience with Thrive.<br />
<br />
It is important to follow the steps to receive a refund. Your best bet may be with the <a class="zem_slink" href="http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=39.5,-111.5&spn=3.0,3.0&q=39.5,-111.5%20(Utah)&t=h" rel="geolocation" target="_blank" title="Utah">Utah</a> Department of Consumer Protection. Call or email to check on the status of your claim. It does take awhile. It took us about 6 months. Some take longer.<br />
<br />
We were also told, "NO WAY" when we requested a refund. Do you really think they are just going to hand you back your money? Unfortunately, you must fight for it. It seems like nothing is happening for a long time and then out of nowhere you will receive a call. <br />
<br />
Keep encouraging each other. United we stand. Remember Thrive has many names to go with their many faces. None of them are good nor are they there to help you. <br />
<br />
Let me know about your blogs. Sign the petition if you haven't already. Good luck to all!!<br />
Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com2tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-91102588049050453372010-04-17T09:00:00.000-07:002014-10-11T07:15:46.531-07:00REFUNDS ARE HAPPENING!<b>People are receiving refunds!</b> So if you are feeling discouraged - STOP. Just regroup and keep working toward your goal. Remember - Thrive and their sales people know they are in the wrong. You just need to keep letting the <a class="zem_slink" href="http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=39.5,-111.5&spn=3.0,3.0&q=39.5,-111.5%20(Utah)&t=h" rel="geolocation" target="_blank" title="Utah">Utah</a> Consumer Protection department know about it. They will do their best for you.<br />
<br />
Sign the petition if you haven't done so!<br />
<br />
If you are wondering about blogs and statements on the forums that have been taken down - know it was part of the deal to get their money back. <br />
<br />
Thrive is still trying to stop all the bad publicity. Problem is for Thrive - when one goes down - another picks up the torch. <br />
<br />
There are a lot of people out there still feeling the sting from Thrives sales bee's.<br />
<br />
Encourage others! United we can stand together and will be strong. :)<br />
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Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com10tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-8707785633831463562010-04-13T02:20:00.000-07:002010-12-15T08:13:21.137-08:00The List Keeps GrowingHere is a list of the Sales Floor companies that work with Thrive. The list keeps getting longer. Let me know if I missed any!<br /><br />A<br />Action Line, Advantage Corporation, Amazing Profits, Amber Harris, American Dream Challenge, American Sales Industries, Auction Profits, Auction Secrets, Auction Sizzle, Auction Success Group, Auctions 4 Income, Auctions For Income, Auctionsecrets.Com<br /><br />B<br />Bid Fuel, Biz Review, Bright Builders, Business Group USA<br /><br />C<br />Cash Secrets, Ckf Consulting, College-Scholarship-Grants.Biz, Colton Moody Consolidated Marketing Group<br /><br />D<br />Dave Espino Diverse Equities, Dm National Llc Dolf De Roos<br /><br />E<br />E-Biz Solutions, E-Pro Coaching, Ebay Auction Success Kit, Electronic Clearinghouse, Epenzio Epi Epibiz Epromo Lls, Executive Marketing<br /><br />F<br />Focus Learning Center, Foreclosure Leads, Foreclosure Secrets, Foreclosure Store, Foreclosure Training, Foreclosure World, Foreclosures, Foreclosureworld, Fortius Group, Frank Kerns, Freebay Wealth, Freebay Wealth Developement Team<br /><br />G<br />Galaxy Mall, Genesis Media, Google Pro, Google Money Tree, Googlemoneyprofit.Com, Government Grants Service, Grant Partners, Grants Biz, Greg Cooper<br /><br />H<br />Hacket Media<br /><br />I<br />Idi, Idi Global Idiglobal.Com, Imergent, Imergent Inc, Income Success Team, Inetseminars Infusion Media, Internet Auction Solutions, Internet Business Solutions, Internet Business Systems, Internet Coaching Group, Internet Development, Internet Development Inc, Internet Logistics, Internet Marketing Conference, Internet Sales Institute, Internet Treasure Chest, Internet Ultra Solutions, Itc Internet Treasure Chest, Iworks, Iworks Incorporated<br /><br />J<br />John Beck, Jordan Publishing<br /><br />L<br />Lfg Inc, Linked Media Resource Inc., Links 4 Trade<br /><br />M<br />Marketing Solutions International, Media Learner, Mentoring Of America, Mentors In Motion, Michelle Valdez Google Pro Kit, Moa, Momentum Marketing, Motivational Fulfillment & Packaging Services, Multiple Streams Of Income, My Ebiz Pro<br /><br />N<br />Nathan Kenyon, National Financial Publishers, National Market Research, National Marketing Resources, National Real Estate Investors Institute, National Training Conference, Netgateway, Newave, Nick Marks Success Training,<br />Nmr (National Marketing Resources), Nmr Coaching<br /><br />O<br />Omni Business Solutions, Online Supplier, Online Supplier Coaching, Onlinebiz Llc<br /><br />P<br />Pacific Webworks, Passive Google Profits, Passport To Millions, Pat Talerico, Paynet Merchant Services, Pcs Professional Consulting Services Pmg – Provo UT, Pmg Mentors Pmgicoaching.Vermotion.Net, Pmgtech.Com Pmi (Professional Marketing Inc/International), Pmi Coaching Power Profit System, Power Seller Consultants, Private Mentoring Group, Process-At-Home By Angel Stevens, Professional Coaching Group, Professional Consulting Services, Professional Marketing Group,<br />Professional Marketing International, Prosper Prosper Inc., Prosper Learning<br /><br />Q<br />Quetico Quicksite, Quicksite Builder, Quicksite National Marketing Resources<br /><br />R<br />Raven Media, Robert Allen, Robert G. Allen, Russ Dalbey<br /><br />S<br />Secure Gate, Selectyourgifts.Com, Start With Focus, Stores Online Storesonline, Strategic Financial Services, Success Team, Success Training Suite 110, Summit, Summit Consulting, Summit Group, Summit Group Internet Coaching, Summit Group Management & Newest Being Summit Group Marketing, Summit Group Of Utah, Summit Group, South Surplus Alert, Spectrum,<br /><br />T<br />Tafiti Consulting, Tekmeds, The Sellers Lounge ,The Success Team, The Summit Group, The Summit Group Llc, The Tax Club, Theo Hansson Coaching, Thrive Learning Institute<br /><br />U<br />Unique Finance, Usight, Usight Home Inc.<br /><br />V<br />Vermotion, Virtual Contact Inc, Virtual Contact Incorporated<br /><br />W<br />Wealth And Self Wholesale Exchange, Wholesale Exchange Llc <a href="http://www.asiincentives.com/">http://www.asiincentives.com/</a><br /><br />Y<br />Yourgiftcards.ComAnonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com7tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-3981910993571156822010-01-13T06:38:00.000-08:002010-01-13T07:26:41.272-08:00GO PETITIONA new petition is now available for all!!<br /><br />Click here and sign. <br /><a href="http://www.gopetition.com/online/33388.html">http://www.gopetition.com/online/33388.html</a><br /><br /><br />Spread the word today!Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-76853979708789257262009-12-24T04:48:00.000-08:002009-12-24T06:55:52.486-08:00BEWARE and BE AWARE!<a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEiH0-TpQcNABJe_idwq1kmwAjsh1t2RIn2U4Ekx1EphX6B4yM3a3zdblWZgTabGBxHdiF1YWsDxwB4lOn6xeJI2fnQg-9OikTdpsKBP0DO6C27yCrPv3DMbQ6MJTd3un_IARFrnwcGwkSk/s320/logodraft03-b+%5B800x600%5D.jpg"><img style="float:left; margin:0 10px 10px 0;cursor:pointer; cursor:hand;width: 320px; height: 320px;" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEiH0-TpQcNABJe_idwq1kmwAjsh1t2RIn2U4Ekx1EphX6B4yM3a3zdblWZgTabGBxHdiF1YWsDxwB4lOn6xeJI2fnQg-9OikTdpsKBP0DO6C27yCrPv3DMbQ6MJTd3un_IARFrnwcGwkSk/s320/logodraft03-b+%5B800x600%5D.jpg" border="0" alt="" /></a><br /><strong>BEWARE!! </strong> Most service fulfillment companies don't much care about you or your future. That's why they ask about your credit rating, "how much money you owe on your credit cards", or "how much money you have access to" (on credit cards and even home equity), etc. This is to see how much money they can get you to part with (scam). Many people have lost their life savings or have been placed in a serious financial crisis. <br /><br />Usually each company has a 3rd party sales company that they work for so the fulfillment company only gets a small precentage. So when you ask for your money back , you will most likely NOT be able to get in touch with the person who sold it to you. Then when you ask the fulfillment company (Thrive) to refund you, they'll tell you to contact the person who sold it to you. Sound familiar!! I have been there!! It is a circus and just part of the scam to get you to become discouraged and give up asking for a refund.<br /><br />Many of these type of companies, like Thrive, prey on the elderly and the baby boomers (the 40's and 50's group). Aren't there laws in some states against stealing from the elderly?<br /><br /><strong>BE AWARE!! </strong> There are people who comment positively (on some forums) about companies like Thrive and claim that they are doing great! They do not, if you notice, give any substantiation to back up that claim. They may very well be a representative of Thrive or another company. It is <strong>OK</strong> to ask that person to show you their website and tell you how many customers visit their site monthly. When and <strong>IF</strong> they post their website link, search it on the web for its statistics. But don't be surprised if you never hear from them to learn of their website!<br /><br />Don't give up! These people must be stopped! Write your letters and post blogs. Complain, complain, and complain until you get your refund! <br /><br /><strong>"Pay it forward" </strong> as one good person I know always says! Help others along the way. Spread the word to warn others about Thrive! <br /><br />You should and can ask questions when a telemarketer calls. Ask for a copy of a contract before you agree to purchase anything. If they do not offer a money back guarantee - DO NOT do business with that company!! Hang up the phone!!<br /><br />Keep this thought in mind.<br /><br /> "If anything sounds too good to be true - it most likely is <strong>NOT</strong> true!"Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com2tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-88926868395133607342009-12-04T17:16:00.000-08:002009-12-04T17:19:59.444-08:00What Thrive Doesn't Tell You!!<strong>If you are considering signing with Thrive Learning Institute - Read This First!!</strong><br /><br /><a href="http://utahsbigblackeye.blogspot.com/2009/11/what-thrive-doesnt-tell-you.html">http://utahsbigblackeye.blogspot.com/2009/11/what-thrive-doesnt-tell-you.html</a>Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-70792716199528167262009-12-04T08:29:00.000-08:002009-12-04T12:15:46.815-08:00Go Petition!As you may have noticed - the petition is down for now. Keep checking back as another one may be the works! We will notify everyone as soon as we can!Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com1tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-35164740535556805372009-12-01T11:48:00.000-08:002009-12-04T17:21:35.627-08:00Articles Concerning Utah Scams!FTC Clamps Down on Telemarketing Fraudsters!<br /><br /><strong><a href="http://www.cityweekly.net/utah/article-8446-called-out.html">http://www.cityweekly.net/utah/article-8446-called-out.html</a></strong><br /><br />Shurtleff Donors Often Have Legal Problems!<br /><br /><strong><a href="http://www.allbusiness.com/government/government-bodies-offices/12833446-1.html">http://www.allbusiness.com/government/government-bodies-offices/12833446-1.html</a></strong><br /><br />Called Into Question!<br /><br /><strong><a href="http://www.cityweekly.net/utah/article-7772-called-into-question.html">http://www.cityweekly.net/utah/article-7772-called-into-question.html</a></strong>Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5668601854989439873.post-9247945356706817332009-11-17T17:51:00.000-08:002009-12-01T12:03:15.825-08:00Just Say NO To Thrive!<a href="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEin4O6AnH0jvm9XDquDdTq3z1EFRLPfZ6E8JApE0KjWEsxfAihZIJu5cef40hkL7GFIjLsiuHDuV-HAUeMa3i1ZfYPnbEHtCwfjyjgB8G5kFa2ftwrygbbkfY3qZv8WUL9B6FmLQ8usso_B/s1600/120px-Logo-no-just-say-no-480.gif"><img style="float:left; margin:0 10px 10px 0;cursor:pointer; cursor:hand;width: 120px; height: 120px;" src="https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEin4O6AnH0jvm9XDquDdTq3z1EFRLPfZ6E8JApE0KjWEsxfAihZIJu5cef40hkL7GFIjLsiuHDuV-HAUeMa3i1ZfYPnbEHtCwfjyjgB8G5kFa2ftwrygbbkfY3qZv8WUL9B6FmLQ8usso_B/s200/120px-Logo-no-just-say-no-480.gif" border="0" alt=""id="BLOGGER_PHOTO_ID_5410360737178686706" /></a><br /><div>We never thought we would be scammed but we were. Charlie Frazer from <strong>Internet Income Solutions</strong> <strong>/Internet Logistics, LLC </strong> sold us the <strong>Thrive Learning Institute</strong> package! He assured us, promised us, we would be making so much money we could pay down our mortgage! By time Thrive got done with us, we could barely pay the credit card company!</div><br />Would $5 -10,000.00 a month change our life? Sure would! Part of their scam plan is to send in the first wave to "qualify" you during the interview as Charlie did by having his wife Chelsea interview us. The purpose of this interview was to find out how much money we had available. This is to make sure it is worth their while to scam vulnerable people out of as many thousands as they can get away with. If you read the many forums, you will notice no two people are charge the same amount. <br /><br />Our team of "professional" coaches couldn't seem to agree. One coach instructed me to design my website one way, another coach had me reconstruct it. Even their written benchmarks are different than the videos and what the coaches suggest you do next. <br /><br />I asked the coaches a question about their websites. "If they were making so much money - why were they working for Thrive?" I never got an answer. <br /><br />Thrive does not find a dropshipper for you. You are just led to believe that they will. You will call many, many, many dropshippers until you find one.<br /><br />Thrive's "trade secrets" are found on the internet for free so don't buy into that line.<br /><br />IIS along with Thrive worked with us to defraud us with goods and services they knew to be inadequate. If Thrive truly provided a quality product, they would not hesitate to guarantee their service. <br /><br />We were not given written disclaimers as the state of Utah "Business Opportunity Disclosure Laws" require. Written substantiation of the earnings disclaimer for our business was not provided.<br /><br />So do not consider doing business with any company especially <strong>Thrive</strong> if they will not guarantee their own product!<br /><br />Early on we realized that we had been deceived, but we still tried to make the program work. And work we did. Much more than the 2 hours a day Charlie said we only had to work. Each step, each month brought more expense and no income. Our business website produced zero income. <br /><br />Another company to avoid is <strong>Imax Bancard </strong>merchant account. Thrive helped me set up this account before my website was even created! When I asked Imax about the charges, they blamed Thrive. When I asked Thrive about the charges, they blamed Imax. Thrive said Imax was impersonating Thrive. I believe Imax is working with Thrive so beware.<br /><br />Play it safe - Hang up the phone when anyone tries to sell you <strong>Thrive Learning Institute</strong>! There are many, many companies working with Thrive to deceive you. <br /><br />I will be posting more information on how to obtain a refund, where to file consumer complaints, and any other useful information I can find. Thanks for reading and spread the word - <strong>"Just Say NO To Thrive!!</strong><strong></strong>Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00943576268393281482noreply@blogger.com3